The US healthcare system sucks shit, plain and simple.
FREE HEALTHCARE is SOCIALISM! FREE SCHOOLING is SOCIALISM! NOT being Gunned Down in School is SOCIALISM! NOT letting Elon Musk fire Hundreds of Thousands of Workers is SOCIALISM! SOCIALISM SUCKS!
But 16 years ago, democrats gave us watered-down heritage foundation health policy and haven’t done shit since! Gen Z are clearly a bunch of ingrates.
Don’t forget that ever since the other side has been trying to tear down that watered down version too, so what little people are given is always under threat of being removed
And the side that passed it doesn’t seem to give much of a shit about protecting it. But lord will they act like it’s the “everything is perfect forever act” if someone expects them to do anything.
Ratchet Effect baby, Ratchet Effect!
It’s funny how so many of the policies of Eisenhower - a Republican - are too much to the Left for the present day Democrat Party.
If I recall correctly, they didn’t have enough votes for single-payer and passed the compromise that they could get done .
Single payer was never on the table, (and if centrists have their way it never will be) and the public option was a bill of goods designed to be jettisoned from the outset.
They had a supermajority. Like always, they find enough no votes.
The original plan for ACA had a single-payer option.
The compromised ACA itself passed the house only by a couple votes. The party is not a monolith and had a number of moderates that opposed single-payer.
The original plan for ACA had a single-payer option.
Like hell it did.
The compromised ACA
The version they always intended to pass.
The party is not a monolith
They expect the voters to vote as a bloc but won’t do so themselves.
and had a number of moderates that opposed single-payer.
No matter how big a majority democrats have, they always find just enough no votes.
It’s Manchin, straight up. And then Ted Kennedy died and they lost the supermajority and had to pass what the Senate had already voted on because anything different would be filibustered.
It was lieberman and nelson. manchin hadn’t rotated in yet.
You’re right, and let’s not forget the Franken recount that lasted until June. So a very brief window to get stuff done.
You’re arguing against well-known historical fact. You have a lot of emotional angst getting in the way of your judgment and understanding of nuance.
The public option was not single payer. It also was never meant to be in the final bill. It was the bargaining chip they were dangling to negotiate with the republicans. When the republicans showed themselves to be unmoveable, they had to get Lieberman to play the part to get rid of it.
Your article doesn’t back up your ridiculous lie that single payer was the original plan for the ACA.
Also, gaslighting is abuse, and it’s no surprise that the republican-adjacent wing of the party resorts to it so quickly.
The country gave them a supermajority and then the bar became “Well you didn’t give us every seat in congress so womp womp.”
Just more bullshit. In no universe does either major party want to lose out on the health insurance confidence scheme bribe money.
The county met them on their nearly impossible terms which a supermajority is, we met our end. they’re just bullshit artists running a con just like the Republican fascists.
Currently waiting to begin taking a medication my doctor prescribed because the pharmacy wouldn’t fill it without prior authorization from the insurance company, but to do that, they had to go back to the doctor to request the doctor fill out paperwork to send to the insurer.
During the appointment with the doctor, we already discussed that my insurer likely will not cover the medication, but looked up the retail price, which is not beyond my means or out of scale with the benefit I expect it to bring me. I’m okay paying out of pocket, but my pharmacy is locked into this process that has stretched out over a holiday weekend, so it’s likely I’ll get the medicine a week later than I otherwise would have.
This is more mental health related, and I’m okay physically, but if the blood tests and years of failed approaches from other methods are any indication, then this could show immediate and significant impact.
But I have to wait for the wheels of capitalism to grind on, so they can ensure maximum value extraction from a very expensive insurance policy.If they don’t cover it, hit up goodRx. My insurance was fucking around with me one month, and I got my lamotrigine down to 20 dollars from 120 dollars using goodRx.
Your pharmacy lied. There is no legal requirement to try to bill insurance first they presumably stand in many cases to bill them more especially if you cash paid only after coupons or patient assistance programs which are essentially coupons.
Thus they choose to follow this process and lie to you.
Oh, yeah. They didn’t even give me an option. Not even really a matter of them saying it was legal or anything. It was a quick awkward convo in which they were too rushed to really listen and I was too flustered to really make them.
I’m not all that annoyed at the pharmacy. They are trying to save me money. My comment is really more about how the insurer adds confusion and delays, because of their second guesses, insisting on verifications, etc.
Guess what. I visit my doctor, for free, (or dentist for $$$) they give me a prescription, I go to a pharmacy and give them the slip, they take some time to fill it, explain how to take it, and then I pay a small fee (80% covered by employer health plan at no direct cost to me) and walk away. Canadian healthcare system at work.
Sure, I have to wait sometimes for major surgery based on the triage approach (most serious cases seen first) but it is painlessly easy to get the care I need when I need it. This is how most of the developed world works. Your country is cheating you.
It still baffles me how some Americans will fight against universal healthcare, like ??? Do you WANT to be put in debt cuz you had an easily-treatable illness??? I don’t get it, honestly
Obviously, transsexuals are a bigger concern. They are educated from birth the US has a superior healthcare system (by every measure, it does not). They are told that a lifetime of debt means they are good Americans .Also, most voters just assume one day they will be billionaires and never get sick.
Yeah… it’s fucking stupid
Propaganda sold to us at an early age.
They are under the impression that what’ll happen is that their paycheck will go down by the cost of universal healthcare per person because the costs are taken out via taxes. Then they hear that some people will get it who don’t pay taxes and they get indignant that they’re paying and someone else is getting. Then they think about the difficulties they have with our current system, and picture putting something like the DMV in front of it, since that’s what a lot of people have as their biggest reference for what the government does.
That’s all because someone has a vested interest in making sure they understand it wrong, and no one is going to make a lot of money off universal healthcare so there isn’t the same degree of motivation to teach people a more accurate understanding.
“Against” has billions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of jobs, and “for” has “human decency”, “efficiency” and “why are we doing this to ourselves”.People hear that your paycheck gets a bit bigger, you go to the doctor when you feel sick, bills are mainly to keep you from going to the doctor for free aspirin and are lower than your copay, and you just … don’t deal with the billing anymore and think that sounds unrealistic. Entirely missing that other countries have done it, that the government already has a medical billing system, and dealing with paperwork is something the government does even better than “moving stuff from one place to another”.
And then there’s other countries whose doctors still receive high wages… America just has a very selfish society in general, I’ve noticed. And, that paycheck argument they make is stupid, because if they have to pay off the debt then their wages will be a lot lower anyways?? Especially for more expensive operations (like transplants).
I honestly don’t have a lot to add, all of you replying to my comment have explained it perfectly. America’s run by idiots, for idiots www
I’d push back against idiots. It’s a little more complicated. It’s meticulously cultivated ignorance amongst many people, since that’s useful. People with money can help people with power maintain power if they help them make more money. So people with power have an incentive to keep people ignorant about things that threaten the bottom line (often. Some have principles and some see the electorate as a better way to maintain power. Obviously nuance exists)
So it’s not that the people who don’t support universal healthcare are always unintelligent, or that the leadership is. You’re not stupid for not understanding something you’ve never experienced, and only been told falsehoods about. It’s why intelligent people sometimes end up against it, and can jump through pretty significant mental hoops to justify that position: every experience says the belief is correct, and it agrees with what they were taught.
There’s a special experience that Americans sometimes get where they’ll travel to another country and get sick or injured. Depending on the country, they might be apologetically informed that because they don’t pay into the system they’ll need to pay full price for the procedure, only to be presented with a bill significantly lower than the fully insured price in the US. Or they just don’t get a bill, depending on the country. I’ve had this happen to two coworkers. One was given a bill for about $200 for a night in the hospital, antivirals, and several units of fluids and electrolytes. The person who presented the bill was adament that there should be a way to bring this down to something more reasonable. In the US that might be a $1000 bill with insurance.
Another had their kid break their arm on vacation, and when they tried to figure out how to pay the doctor just looked confused and asked why he thought they would charge to help a child in medical need. Said it made him realize how backwards our system has made everything, even though he already wanted universal healthcare. Seeing a system that actually put patient care first just felt weird.
Americans are willing to give up everything they own if it means some hypothetical strawman isn’t “mooching” off of their propaganda headcanon.
Success is suffering and hard work and if everyone isn’t suffering then life isn’t fair. Fuck this entire viewpoint, but it’s one of the main American traits ruining socialist ideals.
If you don’t own a million dollar yacht that you use as a tender for your billion dollar yacht you are the hypothetical straw man mooching off the tax dollars of those who do.
My mom had a spinal fusion in the 90s which she got in debt for.
About 15 years ago my lung spontaneously collapsed. Several surgeries later, the bill was $315,000. I was on Obamacare because of the mandate, thank god. I paid $19.
My mom found out and told me I “deserved to go bankrupt” because people like her had struggled for so long with their medical bills.
I don’t speak to her anymore
It’s a cult.
I rlly don’t get ppl like ur mum… shouldn’t she be angry about being forced to pay extortionate amounts of money in the first place ??? Not at the poor person who got lucky ??? Jesus
I have had arguments on social media with Americans. They are A) deluded, believing that paying a monthly premium and still having a deductible, that can be denied, is awesome because its tge best plan avaipable. B) are I got mine types, who have stated they got private insurance because they don’t want to pay for other peoples health care (they clearly don’t understand how insurance works) C) don’t want their taxes to go up one smidge, even though putting every american into a universal system would save so much money and would barely be blip in their taxes.
At this point, just put 15k in a high interest account and only use it if you need to
Until you get some kind of chronic illness and run out of money after about three appointments, then I guess set up a go fund me? You are required to be stabilized but not treated.
That’s basically what an HSA is.
You sign up for a high deductible plan where you pay for your own medical expenses, but document them, up until you hit your out of pocket maximum ($8300 for individuals or $16600 for families), at which point your insurance kicks in to cover the catastrophic bills you typically won’t have in a typical year.
Meanwhile, you are eligible to contribute $4300 per year for individuals or $8750 for families into an HSA, which has very favorable tax treatment (pretax money deposited, not taxed when taken out for health expenses, even after growing a lot), and allows you to invest everything above the minimum cash balance (varies by provider, usually something like $1000 or $2000).
That way in a year you happen to hit a $1 million illness or injury you’re still covered against catastrophic financial loss, but you generally pay your own way with tax-deductible funds that you’re allowed to invest for growth.
There is also no time limit on bills that are eligible to be paid from HSA. So if you are able to, you can pay out of pocket now, keep a copy of the bill, and cash it in 15 years later.
some employers contribute to your HSA, such as matching the amount you contribute each paycheck.
when you contribute to your HSA from each paycheck, that amount is not taxed.
it’s possible to withdraw cash at an ATM from your HSA account if you really need it. no one really stops you from doing this. I saw someone buy weed using cash they withdrew this way.
Goes beyond even that.
At a certain point, you can invest it like a 401k. That’s a giveaway to the stock market. Eventually, you can withdraw it for anything in retirement.
Where a 401k is invested with tax-free money now but gets taxed later, and an IRA is invested with taxed money that doesn’t get taxed later, an HSA is invested tax-free AND doesn’t get taxed later.
What I’m saying is that it’s a giant tax dodge masquerading as a band-aid for a broken healthcare system.
Do what you need to for taking care of you and your family. Maxing out an HSA is generally your best option right now. But just keep in mind that this is a system that shouldn’t exist.
I have some good news for the Gen Zers. America is capitalism with a socialism backbone. Things like social securit, fire departments, national parks, roads, schools, electricity, water, police, jails, courts, unemployment, banking(FDIC), CDC, military, space programs, and so much more are paid by your taxes and redistributed wealth just like socialism.
The problem is when money mixes with politics from things like Citizens United, you start seeing policies shifting away from socialism to capitalism.
This can all be reversed once we remove all money from politics.
But not all schools (university) and notably missing healthcare, apart from VA, Medicare, and Medicaid.
Electricity market is commercial but regulated by government, water at least where I am is government administered but must pay for itself out of its own revenue.
Folks are terrified there’s no fair opportunity to be secure in health, food, and housing. If they have confidence in those three things being securely in reach, then folks would be far less anxious.
Some of those things could be considered socialized, but they do not make our government socialist. Socialized welfare exists under socialism but that’s not what socialism is. Socialism is worker ownership of the means of production. You could even nationalize industries, but without unions, syndicates, or cooperatives collectively making the decisions it’s really only state capitalism.
You would first have to convince party insider democrats to turn their back on the biggest source of funds in their entire history. From your lips to god’s ears and all, but let’s be real. It’s not bloody likely
Before we can do anything about it, people need to know what Citizens United even is. All of us needs to let everyone know what this thing is doing to all of us. We start with knowledge and then vote for those who oppose it.
That sounds way more actionable.
62% in favor of socialism, 34% in favor of communism, 4% in favor of liberalism/fascism?
It’s asking for sentiment individually, not a zero-sum choice.
Another thing to keep in mind is that many in America earnestly view Donald Trump as their chosen leader/ticket to ‘socialism’ that helps them.
Not a meaningful number. Accelerationists are just a spook libs on lemmy use so they can avoid engaging with the left by just accusing them of secretly wanting republicans to win.
I’m Canadian. I highly doubt I pay more than $15k in taxes to get my free healthcare.
European healthcare is something like 6k€ per year and person, the USA is around 14k€ (because leechers and parasites in the system).
Source: some graph on the internet.
We also obviously do mutualise the efforts so even the bum living under the bridge gets the same treatments. We all put in an effort according to what we can, as we are living in a society. What a way to control the masses in the USA. Horrifying.
I bet you get tons of free bonuses too: roads, public education, pensions… Damn, seems like this whole government thing is quite efficient, with the no shareholders taking profits and stuff.
Italian here: 5,000€
the funniest part is that’s not even what socialism is.
Well, it’s not socialism but universal healthcare is a socialist policy and it has been won by various reformist socialist parties in most western countries.
some western countries usually can have such vast welfare state within capitalism because they are still extracting value from their colonies.
Ireland, Poland, Malta, Denmark, Austria, Finland, Sweden, Andorra, Luxembourg and Norway don’t have colonies. And the first three used to be colonies.
some of those you mention engage in imperialism on their neocolonies.
Of course someone from .ml would repeat the same buzzwords without thought.
of course someone from .world decides to be completely ignorant.
Sure bud.
Uncalled for.
You must be new to dealing with MLs. Nothing “uncalled for” for calling out MLs that keep harping about social democratic countries having neocolonies, when literally these countries have none and some of these countries even used to be colonies.
I know. I came from a post-colonial/neocolonial country. But to treat all Western countries as monolith is utterly ridiculous. It is ironically being racist to dismiss white former colonies as neocolonialist like Poland, Ireland and Malta just because they arw white, isn’t? Frankly, the MLs patronise the global south as if they have no agency in the same way as neoliberal imperialists do. Ask Filipinos and Indians on what they think of CPP-NPA and Naxalites, respectively. MLs would actually get more respect and taken seriously if they aren’t being hypocritical like the neoliberals. ML is just another form of tyranny with a different mask.
“Socialism is when government does stuff like laws and currency.”
“Socialism is when they take some gold from the dragon”
really? i though it was when no iphone. (and sometimes vuvuzela)
Can you not see them describing the government doing stuff?
My insurance premiums are closer to $12,000 a year (basically a hop, skip, and a jump from $1,000 a month).
It certainly isn’t the most expensive plan I found, but it was up there. I knew about all the shitty practices by insurance companies, but I tried to do my research to ensure that my prescriptions and doctors were covered, and I hoped that with a plan this expensive, I might be a bit insulated from the worst of it.
Then I had an emergency. Three things that my insurance did not cover really stood out to me.
The ambulance was considered out of network, so I am on the hook for 100% of the cost. You don’t have any choice about which service picks you up.
The doctor was out of network, so I have to pay 100% of his charges. I know he probably approved my treatment or reviewed my test results, whatever, but I never saw him and the only treatment I received came from the nurses.
I was given 2 ibuprofen. They cost me $45. I was given several different and conflicting reasons why, but ultimately, I’m on the hook for that.
I wouldn’t pay it. As of now, medical debt can’t hurt your credit score. When they send it to collectors, just deny the debt is yours. Refuse to give the collectors any info and don’t accept the debt.
Do you have any sources?
I tried to double check and all i found is that:
The three nationwide credit reporting agencies will generally not report medical debt on your credit report until the debt has been unpaid for at least 180 days (about six months).
I am preparing a pamphlet for getting and navigating US healthcare and that would be an amazing addition.
Apparently, 15 states prohibit it from hitting your credit. I was under the impression that it was nationwide.
By chance do you have a source to this?
It was a law from Biden that went into effect in January but trump had vacated in July, all this year. There’s a lot of confusion on this because of the flip flop.
https://www.nclc.org/resources/dont-add-further-insult-to-injury-medical-debt-credit-reports/
This was the story I saw. I know in my state, it can’t ding your credit.
Boomers be booming.
They should get rid of the single largest socialist government expenditure on the planet (the US military) and then tell everyone they need to get Defence insurance.
Please stop saying the military is socialist. Please understand that socialism is about the relationship to the means of production and not just ‘exists because tax’
Bro with nazi dogwhistles as username and a pp from a stock site posting Fox News screen
I miss goods olds psyops when their were at least pretending to target intelligence
How is a
SwedishSwiss gun company and a date 75 years before Hitler was born a Nazi dogwhistle?Fox News viewer choosing a foreign company name accidentaly having two S as initial. Then because of the first 1417 peoples having the same idea put the numbers meaning ADolf and Adolf Hitler in every fucking nazi band since the 70’s
Totally not another right wing militant farming engagement on socials networks
That’s borderline numerology. He’s obviously a right-wing dipshit, but you’re just looking for dogwhistles instead of calling him out for what he’s actually saying.
at least faux news took the effort of separating communism and socialism, as they often use those terms as they mean the same
“That’s what a dirty commie would say!” shakes athritis-riddled fist in pain
takes arthritis pills covered by medicare
for now
Of what use, then, are the American Communists?
They serve one function extremely useful to you and to the country, so useful that, if there were no Communists, we would almost be forced to create some. They are a reliable litmus paper for detecting real sources of danger to the Republic.
Communism is so repugnant to almost all Americans, when they are getting along even tolerably well, that one may predict with certainty that any social field or group in which the Communists make real strides in gaining members or acceptance of their doctrines, any such spot is in such bad shape from real and not imaginary social ills that the rest of us should take emergency, drastic action to investigate and correct the trouble.
Unfortunately we are more prone to ignore the sick spot thus disclosed and content ourselves with calling out more cops.
–Robert A. Heinlein, Take Back Your Government
I thought “tankie” was the new “commie” but maybe that’s just for DNC true believers because calling people with even the slightest leftwing ideas or who are skeptical of the political propaganda from the US a “Communist”, is too obvious Red Scare-style Propaganda and unlike the fans of the outright Fascist party, the fans of the Fascism-adjacent party actually care about keeping up appearances.
Oh my God, we’ve finally yelled at Americans on the internet enough that after A H U N D R E D F U C K I N G Y E A R S conservatives are vaguely aware that there’s some linguistic difference!
It does work, guys!
They get confused because they’re so used to conflating capitalism with fascism, because that’s what they want fascism but call it capitalism to make it more palatable. Fortunately they’re utterly shit at selling the idea.
Last year there was the national conservatives conference, attended by right wing nut cases the world over, and it was like attending in 1920s Nazi rally. That’s not hyperbole, it was literally like that, the same fat idiots vaguely wondering around without a clue what they were espousing, interspersed with the occasional bright spark who was actually pushing it all.
Plus, this is simply a poll of “what’s your favorability of the word we use to say something is when we don’t we don’t like the thing?”
